Stopped and fined for Speeding

Help & Advice Legal
1

The other day i was stopped by a cop on a bike hiding in a side road/layby.

When pulled over the officer claimed i was doing around 50mph in a 30mph zone.

Im sure i was doing nowhere near this speed and disputed the matter firmly with the officer who in the end issued me a fixed penalty for doing 45 in a 30mph zone which i still disagree with.

I have to produce my license documents in the local station with n 7 days. The penalty is for 60 pounds and i think 3 points (does anyone know)

At the time i was pretty annoyed and it didn’t cross my mind to ask for proof of my alleged speed but when i got home and spoke to a mate about it he asked me if i was captured using speed gun/camera. To my knowledge there was no speed camera used and i think the officer just did a visual check.

If this is the case can anyone advise me where i stand with regards to challenging the penalty?

am i with in my rights to challenge, asking for photographic evidence of me committing the alleged offence?

does anyone know what the procedure would be if i were to challenge and would i likely cost more than the ticket itself?

Finally the officer asked me to sign the penalty notice at the roadside which i did. In doing so have i made the mistake of admitting to the offence which would reduce my chances of successfully challenging the penalty.

Many thanks in advance for the help.

2

In terms of asking for photographic evidence they have changed the way in which you do it in order to detair people from doing it I guess. You basically have to plead not guilty from when you fill in the NiP and then in front of the court request to see the evidence. The case will then be adjurned whilst the evidence is sent to you.

After that I dont know???

I bottled it as I knew they had me on camera and knew I was clutching at straws. Its pretty safe to say if you get the Nip via the post like I did they already have your reg and no doubt a good pic. But in your case who knows???

In hindsight I should of contested it as it saw me banned, technically I had nothing to loose.

3

As Ryan said above you can opt for a not guilty trial at Magistrates Court and just like any other matter,he will have to provide evidence to support the allegation. You are entitled to advance disclosure of the evidence against you to prepare your defence.If you can it would benefit you getting legal advice and representation.As Elad found it can be worth challenging the evidence as mistakes are often made.The fact that he lowered the speed apparently after your protest is worthy of note as the gun,assuming he had some sort of measuring equipment, would have given an exact speed and that speed should be on the ticket not a negotiated one. If he did it purely on a visual basis,which sounds unlikely,its very unreliable and would certainly be very worthy of a challenge,also the CPS like a high “winnability” level before taking a not guilty trial.The only downside could be that should you be found guilty the punishment could be harsher than the initial ticket !!

4

Thats the thing mate…not to mention the cost of obtaining legal advice and representation which i think would be more than the 60 quid penalty.part of me says it would be easier to just take the fine and points and be done with the hassle but on the other hand i think if i can get off with out the points/penalty then i should go for it

5

You could represent yourself…Didn’t Elad do this or was prepared to do this?

6

What speed were you actually doing when you got pulled?

Were you speeding?

7

Can’t remember whether Elad represented himself but I do remember that in the report the officer said his bike was Blue when was actually red (well more brown really but if you cleaned it it would have been red) and I think that made the case fall appart.

8

What type of device was used to record your speed, Lazer, VASCAR?

A number of points to bear in mind.

You can challenge the allegation and plead not guilty and go to Magistrates court. The reporting officer will be called to give evidence and will give an exact account of how he detected you commiting the alleged offence, how the speed was recorded and the fact that he issued you with a verbal NIP.

Included in this will be calibration details of the speed measuring equipment device used.

Contrary to all the crap and bullshit spouted on the net, there is no requirement for the offender to be photographed speeding, it just happens thhat these days more people are caught by cameras than anything else.

A Traffic cop is allowed to give evidence of opinion in speed cases. So one of his opening lines will be along the lines the “He formed the opinion that the vehicle was travelling above the XX MPH speed limit” and used whatever calibrated device to record the speed.

If it was a following check, then you have to be followed for a minimum distance of 2/10 of a mile on urban and rural roads and a minimum of 1 mile on a Motorway, and a single copper on his own can report, it does not have to be coroborated by another.

Now, a traffic cop is regarded as an expert in law and is one of the few policemen who is allowed to give evidence of opinion (the other is being drunk), and so unless you can show that he was procedurally incorrect or you can prove that you could not have been doing the speed stated for whatever reason, then the chances are you will be convicted and usually the fines and points are substantially higher ass you will also get hit with court costs

Bear in mind also that a traffic cop can report for speed reckless, and for this offence he does not need to record your speed but again can secure a conviction simply on the evidence of opinion, but it is an offence that is not used very much.

It is very rare (not impossible) for a not guilty plea to succeed, and so you need to think very carefully whether it is worth the potential of being disqualified (which the courts can do) and risk potentially higher fines and costs.

This advice is based purely on advice as 20 years service as a traffic cop before going into private law.

9

Hi TC,

Many thanks for the informative reply…to be honest i was hoping i could get a reply from a cop or in your case ex, as you guys have the most experience in this field.

As far as i know the officer did not use any speed measuring device to catch me… im pretty sure it was just his opinion/ a visual check ( i didnt ask at the time)

He i dont think he follwed me for 2/10 of a mile.

The points you make regarding the officer being allowed to give evidence in court based on his/her opinion i guess would see me with an extra court cost and more points so i think ill be better off just swallowing the £60 and 3 points to avoid the extra hassle.

thanks again for the advice

:slight_smile:

10

If you were given a fixed penalty, then somewhere on the ticket it should state how your speed was recorded, if you are awaiting a summons to drop through the post, then again there will be a record of what type of recording device was used, i,e camera, VASCAR, Lazer etc.

A summons will have a brief explanation of the circumstances surrounding the alleged offence. It is very unlikely that you will have been reported for speed reckless as you would have been told at the time, and the fact that specific speeds were mentioned means that somewhere your speed was recorded and certain protocols have to be complied with to ensure that the regulations have been complied with.

If it was a following check, again this should be recorded in the evidence, but again if he was already in front of you, this is unlikely to be the case.

These days very few mistakes are made in speed cases (that is not to say that they never happen) and experienced traffic cops make sure all the T’s are crossed and I’s are dotted.

Like you say, you may just have to take it on the chin.

11

The fact that he changed his initial “opinion” of your speed will greatly undermine any “expert” testimony he might have given before a court. An expert that changes their mind when challenged by a newb on a bike is clearly no expert at all. This also makes you wonder what sort of device he was using if he first suggested you were travelling at 50 then changed it to 45.

I got pulled once doing 42 mile an hour in a 30 zone with a pillion on the back, I managed to get away without a ticket, but the point is, they knew to the mile what speed I was going…not some rounded off number. It was 42 mile an hour and the guy showed me the gun.

Now the fact that he was hiding in a side-street, caught a glimpse of you, and then changed his mind about your speed, makes me think that you have a good case to say that he clearly could not have known your actual speed, that any expertise he may have is undermined both by the rounding off of the speed you allegedly were travelling and by the fact that he could only have caught a glimpse of your from the side for a split second, and he apparently based his decision on that.

Personally, I would go to court and plead not guilty to that one, but I am studying law and am training to be a Barrister, so I think I am happier about turning up in court.

Bear this in mind though, the 3 points on your licence can affect job opportunities and insurance costs as well as the initial £60 fine. So you have to weigh all the costs, not simply the money.

12

yes its a 60 pound fixed penalty, however no where on the penalty does it state what type of measuring device was used.

just an area saying ‘’ you were driving using a reported speed of 45mph’’

then an offence code 130 and in the text box the cop just wrote down ‘‘exceeding 30mph limit’’

ive got to do show my liscense documents within 7 days so will go in the next 2 days and see what occurs

13

hi

about speeding i was caught the other week by camra doing 34

in a 30 mile limit and got a £60 fine and 3 points

so i think it would count for you also chris

14

there is no doubt some good advice amongst this post by people that know a lot more about the legal workings than i do.

it seems the officer has all the evidence a court will need, you signed the ticket, admitted the allegation of exceeding the speed limit.

sounds like you will have to take this on the chin.

15

I do not think that is right Wolfie. I don’t think accepting the piece of paper is admission of guilt. Sorry misread you, you are saying that his signing of the ticket was acceptance.

16

I had a similar case back in 1999 on the mall were a bike cop followed me and tried doing me for 40 in a 30mph. I pleaded not guilty and went to court. He had written my address down as ‘Park’ and not ‘Oak’ on the ticket so my defence was if he could make a mistake looking at my license and reading Park instead of Oak, he made a mistake when looking at his speedo.

Not sure if it would have worked or not but the cop failed to attend court so the case was dismissed and my license stayed clean :stuck_out_tongue:

Check the ticket for any errors would be my advice.

17

Signing the ticket is not an admission of guilt and does not remove your right to challenge the allegation and plead not guity.

The signature is simply an acknowledgement that you have been issued with the ticket, and in some cases can be used to help identify individuals.

18

[quote]
weeman (09/04/2010)

Broady is a cop.

19

They thought his bike was blue, when it’s red? Crikey thats poor xD

20

Years ago - 1979 I think- I went to court to contest getting done for going though a red light (on the Aldgate one-way (as it was then) system. In court, the cop said that my assertion that the light was not red could not be relied upon because he was parked right by the lights in a marked police car, and if I didn’t spot that, I obviously wan’t paying attention.

Actually, the cop car was totally unmarked - which he blatantly denied. So basically he was a lying b*****d. Luckily the cop turned up on his own in court as his partner was ill and couldn’t attend, and it was his word against mine. As we told totally different stories and neither of us had anyone to corrororate them, the magistrate decided there was insufficient evidnence and dismissed the case.

Cops may be more honest these days :wink: - but if this guy was prepared to change the speed he reckoned you were doing - I bet he’ll deny doing that in court, so I wouldn’t rely on that to help you - unless he wrote it down and then changed it so that you have solid evidence.

Phil