So I think i’d like to get some advanced rider training. I’ve been riding for 11 years but there’s always room for improvement.
I think my girlfriend would also benefit from some more training as she has had her full licence for a good few years now, but is lacking in confidence out on the open road.
Where to start? Dive in and do the IAM advanced rider course? Or look at the ROSPA thing they do? Are there any other things people would recommend?
Cheers
Ady
Both IAM and RoSPA are worthy of consideration, although I will put my cards on the table and admit that I am biased towards RoSPA being a senior (and former chief motorcycle) examiner for them and having instructed at advanced level for 30+ years.
The IAM is now on a par with RoSPA as far as the standards are concerned, IAM tend to be more geared towards the social sice of things, but to a certain degree they still suffer from a pipe and slippers type perception, or the go like F*ck whenever you can syndrome. The attitude is changing, but there are stil some groups that are struggling to change and I am fortunate that I get to see many different groups.
Bikesafe is regarded by many as a good starting point or introduction, but personally I have some issues with Bikesafe.
This article I wrote last summer might give you an idea of what we as examiners are looking for. Speak to others and ask whether they have had training.
If you want recommendations for either a group or individual I will be happy to provide you with details of a few contacts.
If I had a pound for every time someone told me how much they would like to be an advanced riding examiner, I have no doubt that I would be a very wealthy man by now.
Many people believe that examiners get well paid for doing something that they enjoy, but in reality nothing could be further from the truth. In fact it is probably fair to say that, without exception, all of us do it because of our love of motorcycling.
So what does being an advanced riding examiner entail?
At the moment, both the Institute of Advanced Motorists (IAM) and The Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents (RoSPA) use only Police class 1 qualified riders.
In the coming years this may change as many police forces are terminating their bike sections resulting in fewer riders being trained to the class 1 standard. I know that RoSPA are considering appointing diploma holders as examiners at some time in the future.
All examiners are motorcyclists in their own right, and the majority choose to become examiners quite simply because, having had the benefit of possibly the best training in the world, it is a way of helping other riders to enhance their enjoyment and their riding standards.
Test candidates are always nervous, and to be honest who wouldn’t be? So our first duty on meeting them is to try and put them at their ease and help them to relax.
Before the test commences I always give the candidate a briefing of how the test will be conducted and I know that many of my colleagues do the same. I also explain what I am looking for and what they should do if a problem arises. Finally I emphasise the fun factor, after all I want to enjoy myself as well.
The practical element of the test lasts for about 90 minutes, during which time as many different types of road and traffic situations as possible will be covered. The examiner will follow behind the candidate, varying their road position during the course of the ride to get an overview of how the candidate is performing.
For example, the examiner may change position from being fairly close to the rear of the candidate’s machine to dropping some distance behind. The important thing is that the candidates should ride for themselves and ignore the examiner’s presence, which I appreciate is often easier said than done.
During the course of the test, we are looking at every aspect of the ride. Does the rider have good observation skills? Do they read the road well? Do they plan well in advance? What is their road positioning like? Are they systemised? Are they smooth? Most importantly are they safe?
We look at the overall picture and then make a determination as to what grade we feel they have merited or, in the case of the IAM test, whether they have attained the standard required to be given a pass.
At the conclusion of the practical test, usually over a coffee, we will then ask a number of questions on the Highway Code and simple bike maintenance, before starting a debrief on how the candidate performed.
The debrief is the candidate’s opportunity to make any points about the ride which they think are relative or may have a bearing. They may have recognised areas where they did not perform as well as they might have wished, or there may be areas of the ride they wish to qualify as sometimes our position can give us a different perspective, particularly when we are riding 100 yards or more behind.
At the completion of the debrief, we will tell the candidate if they have passed and what grade has been awarded and discuss any last points they may have.
Once the practical element of the test is complete, the test report is written up and forwarded to head office to be typed and sent out to the candidate together with their certificate.
Examiners get paid just enough to cover their travelling expenses, so as you can probably gather, we don’t do it for the money. For me it is about meeting fellow riders, being able to pass on the benefits of my experience, putting something back into motorcycling and hopefully enhancing the individual’s own enjoyment of riding a motorcycle.
I would suggest ELAM (East London Advanced Motorcyclists) contactable via www.elam.org.uk .
Thanks for this guys. I did bikesafe several years ago and while interesting I don’t think it gave that much in the way of advanced riding.
From the research I had done, ELAM is the most convenient of the groups to us - we live in Homerton, Hackney.
I just wasn’t sure hot IAM / RoSPA compared…
I’ll drop ELAM a line - we live in Homerton so it’s the closest of the IAM branches to us. They offer a free taster so will see if there’s something that works for me and the missus together…
I went to Kevin for training. He is a top fellow and very practical. Huge experience and makes the training tailored and accessible.
I did a day with Rapid Training. Fantastic experience, learnt a lot. Think I should do another one soon.
Have you had any dealings with Middlesex or Home Counties North?I went to Kevin for training. He is a top fellow and very practical. Huge experience and makes the training tailored and accessible. http://www.survivalskills.co.uk/ makmanEvery person I have ever examined who has been trained by him, I have failed on test.
ELAM are a good group.
LAM at Banstead are very good as well.
EAMG at Chelmsford are not that far out anf they are also very good but they train to a standard rather than a badge and then let individuals decide which test they want to take if they want to take the test. Some want a badge, some just want to improve their standards.
T.C
Only examining a few of their members but that was a few years ago. Standards was quite good if I recall
I did IAM a year ago. They do a free taster ride (with feedback) and you can get a feel for your trainer. I liked my guy (and aware of their reputation as boring old farts) asked if he could be my observer.
If you are a competent London rider, just remember that out in the sticks, they don’t spend much time in heavy traffic, so you need to adapt to their different approach to town riding 
Their rides can be a bit slow, often the leaders religiously observe speed limits…
I got on well with ELAM, found them good. My wife is currently doing course with them and getting on well too. Though, I am rather biased as I’ve now been assimilated into their committee… 
Once I get a new bike in sept (hopefully) gonna join the local Cambridge branch, need to find out how it works with me having my Motorcycle Response Certification and go from there
Ahhh ok, will call them to sort it out as I can claim exemption.
IAM tend to be more geared towards the social sice of things, but to a certain degree they still suffer from a pipe and slippers type perception, or the go like F*ck whenever you can syndrome. The attitude is changing, but there are stil some groups that are struggling to change and I am fortunate that I get to see many different groups.About 300yrs ago I did my training with Chelmsford (who you go on to mention). On a summer club night the car park was full with everything from Vintage, to RC30's and even a CR500! They were only IAM back then and were still very much "pipe and slippers vs GLF". I looked into Observer Training (mid 1990s') and they were trying to get everyone on to the same hymn sheet back then!
T.C
I’ve not been back there for very many years, but they had morphed into something even more special.
Incidentally, my Observer (Adrian) looked very pipe’n’slippers with his reflective belt and his fully faired r80 bmw, but he was very GLF when the observed rides had finished! We’d stay out for ages after the official ride had finished…
Being a courier for 16 years and surviving!.....Kevin obviously learnt some skillsI went to Kevin for training. He is a top fellow and very practical. Huge experience and makes the training tailored and accessible. http://www.survivalskills.co.uk/ makmanEvery person I have ever examined who has been trained by him, I have failed on test.
ELAM are a good group.
LAM at Banstead are very good as well.
EAMG at Chelmsford are not that far out anf they are also very good but they train to a standard rather than a badge and then let individuals decide which test they want to take if they want to take the test. Some want a badge, some just want to improve their standards.
T.C
Being a courier for 16 years and surviving!.....Kevin obviously learnt some skillsDepends on your point of view
Rusty99
My point of view is what he taught me 8 years ago is still be used today. It is accessible training, spot on for road riders and to the standard of keeping me alive. Works for me. All depends on what people are being “tested” for. If it is to adhere to ROSPA or IAM, then Kevin will not be the man for that as his training IMO eclipses that. for reality riding. Horses for courses I guess.
Great.... If it works for you and suits you, then I am not going to argue.
My point of view is what he taught me 8 years ago is still be used today. It is accessible training, spot on for road riders and to the standard of keeping me alive. Works for me. All depends on what people are being "tested" for. If it is to adhere to ROSPA or IAM, then Kevin will not be the man for that as his training IMO eclipses that. for reality riding. Horses for courses I guess.
makman
On test, I never ask anyone who they have trained with until after the test has been completed and I have awarded the grade, so I have no preconceived ideas or opinions. But it does concern me a little that when you get the same issues repeating themselves, that something is amiss with the knowledge skills or mindset, which in itself may not be a problem until it goes horribly wrong.
As you say, horses for courses…
Sorry makman I thought you were recommending this Kevin to tearch the Advanced System of riding. Do you know how his training differs?
TC, taking Kevin out of the conversation for a moment, before you enquire as to where a testee(?) has trained, how often do you guess correctly? Come on, confess
