hey all,
i just want to share a quick story of something that happened to me on my way back from work few minutes ago.
I was driving my bike in Camden, maybe a bit friskily and i may have passed the speed limit by a mile or two. anyway i pass a guy on a bike (unmarked ST1300), i stop a bit further down the road at a red light. this guy approaches me, and shows me his cop badge and asks me to pull over. I abide.
he starts telling me that i was going at 47 miles per hour when the limit is 30, and that i sped also in other two points, plus since my wheel is passing the line at red light, that’s considered passing with red light. anyway. he tells me that the points on my license that i will lose are 15 and he will take me to court and all and that i will receive a summon within 6 months. He schools me a bit more and finally sets off.
now the whole scene is going through my head again and things don’t make much sense:
I asked him if he had a radar detector of some sort, he said that he was driving at the limit and saw me speeding. (how can he be so sure of the 47mph figure then?).
he showed me his badge for a second. I wanted to ask for his name and id, but at the same time i didn’t want to piss him off any further, so i didn’t. he wasn’t wearing any identification mark on his jacket/bike… just a normal rider in a black leather suit.
he saw my license, but didn’t write me a ticket, i didn’t sign anything, there are no speed camera pictures. can he really take me to court without any proof? he didn’t seem to write anything down as well…
he asked for my personal information (address, where do i work), but again, he didn’t write it down.
I have his reg plate
scenario 1. this guy is a cop going back home from work and wanted to scare me off a bit.
scenario 2. the guy is not even a police man and wanted to play me fool.
scenario 3. i will really receive a court summons. in which case it will be my word against his, and i will probably come with a scenario of ‘i never met this guy before’.
If you receive a verbal ‘notice of intended prosecution’ then they have 14 days to serve you the written NIP in all but a few cases (when they can’t find the registered keeper, i.e. if you changed your address and didn’t tell them).
Where did he get 6 months from?
Also, how were 15 points calculated?
3 for the red light but the other 12 points- what are they for?
Speeding is 3 points for a fixed penalty notice and 6 points if they prosecute you.
As far as ‘proof’- yes, you can be prosecuted without proof.
There is room within the legislation for a policeman to use his judgement.
He doesn’t have to prove you were doing 47 in a 30, just that you were over 30.
That would get you a maximum of 6 points (I guess plus the red light) though, not 15 points.
Still, sounds pretty strange.
If nothing terns up in the next 2 weeks and you have the correct address at the DVLA then I would think you’d be fine.
That sounds bizarre, sounds like some vigilante clown. I’ve never come across a police officer giving someone grief and then saying, points are in the mail. It takes what, 5 minutes to write you up. If it’s bothering you, maybe go to a police station and speak to them about the incident. That shouldn’t affect the outcome and they should be able to tell you the actual procedure. Or find a copper on here and ask them, do it offline though.
It appears to be not genuine to me,nothing rings true about the whole encounter. I would report it to your local Police station,impersonating Police is a matter that would be taken seriously:)
(As an aside,there is a time limit for issue of summons of 6 months from date of offence)
I thought that a warrant card wasn’t enough to be able to stop you, and they needed to be in uniform. Have you ever noticed that when you get stopped by any traffic officer, the first thing they do it shove their hat on? That’s not a coincidence. Its the uniform. I would be wary where you parked your bike now. https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q587.htm Note the ‘MUST be in uniform’ bit.
BUT, to address some of the questions -
I don’t think its as simple as ‘you weren’t going 30’. I think the copper has to have some sort of idea of the speed at which you were going, by reference to something. If he was following you, and he saw that he had to be going at a certain speed to catch you, or he was going at such a speed in excess of the limit and you were still pulling away, then that is one thing, but establishing a speeding offence without a camera or any sort of detector in traffic? Tricky would be my thought.
Assuming that you were validly stopped by a police officer, you got given an NIP verbally at the roadside. You now have 6 months to be summonsed. Watch the clock - a friend of mine has this, and got his summons 1 week after the 6 month time limit, but dated within a few days of the limit. The judge threw it out as not being issued in time.
15 points would have been the multiple speeding offences - they would be pushing for more than 3 points for each offence - if its only 3 points then they would deal with them under FPNs unless there was a ban risk where they must prosecute. They were probably 4 points each, so 12 for the speeding, 3 for the red light.
Copper has no business asking where you work. Name and address only. Possibly date of birth for him to run a check on you there and then. Also ‘is this your vehicle sir? Do you own any other ones?’ He shouldn’t mind being asked why he wants to know and what entitles him to ask. If he gets pissed off, its because he’s not entitled to ask, or at least you’re not obliged to answer.
On the strength of the ‘not in uniform’ bit alone, I would be mentioning it to my local cop shop as a concerned citizen that there is someone out there potentially impersonating a police officer, or a police officer acting otherwise than in accordance with their authority.
1, you don’t have to wear a hat to give a ticket out…that’s just an old wives tale, but you need to be in uniform.
2, probably some jobs worth on the way home/to work and wanted to ‘give you words of advice’
3, 30 is 30 so slow down and don’t give anyone an excuse to pull you over…simples.
I don’t think he was a cop undercover. I think he was just a cop off duty.
Does he have the power to hand out tickets/bring people to court being off duty?
Also, there is no evidence that he pulled me over or talked to me. Does this mean that any of us could receive a summons to appear for doing something we were not even aware of.
Don’t under cover cop bikes have a speed radar gun fitted? The last one I saw on one of the daft motorway cop/traffic police/car crash channel 5 TV type programs had one fitted, with a big black speed read out box bolted to bars.
Hmm, was this a grey/silver bike? Did he also have on one of those jackets that look like the police ones but when you get up close its slightly different?
I saw this guy this morning in the Old street area and couldn’t work out if he was or not as nothing on the bike looked like one of the normal police ones…
Police are never “Off Duty” a very good mate of mine is a Copper, we were out on the P1ss last year and a fight broke out between 2 blokes and he had to make himself known as a police officer and try to stop the fight, he was p1ssed himself but went in to the station and had to fill out statements and even got paid OT for doing so!!!
my point is that he wasn’t driving a camouflaged police bike. he was on his own personal bike going back home. no radar detector, radio, gadgets of any sort.
Quite. You do need to be in uniform. I would not expect that Black leathers and a white helmet would count as uniform, otherwise anyone wearing black leathers and a white helmet would probably be impersonating a police officer, or at least risking that. A white helmet with ‘Police’ written on it might count as uniform. Epaulettes on your jacket showing your rank and number would probably be uniform. But the way that most traffic cops identify themselves as being police is with the hat.
