Ok, its happened to me a few times and touch wood i have allways managed to save myself and the bike. I find now as I try and to improve my ridign that I am analysing these slides and trying to determine:-
a) Why they happened?
b) How I saved the bike?
C) How to stop it in the future?
I am pretty sure I know why they happen, in that I am placing too much demand on the front tyre for the grip available, ie countersteering hard in to a corner.
Bit how did I save it? blowed if I know any one on here got any ideas?
As for stopping in the future I guess its just reading the road better. ie this morning taking a 90 degree corner, on a bus route, in the wet, at 40 ish will result in the front wheel reliunquishing grip on the road.
in a straight line - too much braking force applied before weight transfer to the front (have learnt the hard way on this one what happens when you aren’t progressive and panic brake). braking needs to be like a dinosaurs back (cant remember where i got that analogy from). relatively small amount of braking initially as weight loads forward and then you can apply most of your braking force etc…
in a corner, too much speed vs conditions like you say. also tyres/pressures and how smooth your inputs are considering. if you hang off, how smoothly do you shift your weight/is your body in the wrong place. just being off the power does much the same as braking as you’re still loading the front due to engine braking/compression not released from braking. you need to get your braking/gears etc all sorted before your make your entry to the corner, and be back on the throttle to balance the suspension reducing some of the front load and provide grip from the rear. dramatic attempts to change line can overpower the front, esp in the wet
obviously front brake in a corner is bad news other than trail braking as you enter, and that aint a great idea on the road
if you’re in a corner too hot and lose the front, its just luck that you’ve saved it so far. slow in, fast out, esp on the road
this site is pretty cool for riding techniques and prob explain stuff much better than i can
If I have been lucky then I am off to do the lottery!
I know I am doing everything right, bar one thing when I get into the corners, and i think that is carrying too much speed into corner for the grip available on the roaad, I did say this was on a bus route so diesel and rain make it like an ice rink.
What I was wondering is how I had saved it, guess it must be luck. Have read countless better riding books and the site referred to above, no on mentions revoering from a front end slide. Not only happened to me, both CBF Matt and I had front end slides on same spot of a41 near hendon and saved it!
You`re either very skillful or very lucky to get away with a front end slide Dan.
If you`re losing the front when braking in a straight line then you may be grabbing the front brake too quickly. The simple proven technique is gentle at first for a fraction of a second(to get the weight transferred to the front tyre during which the tyre contact patch grows) then progressively harder and easing off gently just before your turn point.
If your losing the front as you`re entering a turn it could be many things. Firstly be off the brakes at the turn point for the corner.(this reduces the load on the front and makes the bike easier to steer.
Secondly there should be no more steering inputs after the turn point and thirdly if your carrying too much lean angle and running out of traction.
Regarding countersteering, its surprising but its almost impossible to lose the front if youre off the brakes when you countersteer at your turn point. Its also good practice to pick up 1-2mm of throttle in the middle of the turn this settles the bike and spreads the grip between the two wheels.
I know its easier said than done but if you have a problem in a turn then its best not to grab the brake or tense on the bars but try and relax and ride it out.
Practice going in to a turn a bit slower but getting on the gas earlier and as the turn opens up gently accelerating through it. You`ll be very unlikely to lose the front then
There`s your problem. Counter steering at the turn point is good but steering inputs in the turn are not necessary and can overload the front tyre and unsettle the bike. Relax on the bars
In the turn the steering is best done with the throttle. This simply means adding throttle if the turn widens or reducing throttle where you want to reduce the arc.
Happy cornering
I had a very significant front wheel slide last November, the front wheel moved well over six inches the steering tucked and i ran wide across a set of double white lines, fortunately just getting the bike back on my side of the road before a truck came into the bend from the other direction.
That had me really confused, I take that corner everyday, normally at or around the speed and in the manner that I did that day, I stopped and there was no mud (visible) diesel and the road was dry. In the end I put it down to the temperature of the road, it was colder than it had been and I was still on Sports tyres on the VFR and they were stone cold even after about 10 miles. I switched to Sport Touring tyres the next day and they were far better.
My tuppence for what it is worth, if you do adopt the slow in fast out method, this will also allow you to ride through the corner with a positive throttle, thus keepin the weight distribution slightly rearward, its damn near immpossible to lose the front in this scenario. (barring dramatic surface condition changes)
remember that cutting or rolling off the throttle has the same effect as braking (not as violent) in terms of front/rear weight distribution. Could also be why you feel the need to make mid corner steering input, as the bike geometry changes so will your arc through the corner
Are you 100% sure that the profile on the front tyre is correct. I had a really odd experience when a 60 profile instead of 70 had been fitted by mistake to my bike, the front really felt like it was tucking all the time under cornering, whilst the difference between 60 & 70 profile sounds relatively small, it makes about an inch difference to the rolling diameter and significantly affects the handling of the bike…
Other than that, technique is the key I bet… Twist of the wrist II - Keith Code - read and Inwardly digest, then read again and practice, if you’ve got more cash than the 15 odd quid for the book, go and do California Super Bike school level 1 - about £300 notes…
Hammersmith roundabout is awful when wet, I’ve lost the front about three times going round there in the last couple of months. Always a laugh, though I prefer the back sliding to the front.
