Bus Lane usage - protest time?

Off-topic
41

Just for info, this is the email I sent and answer to it:

"Sir, my name is Chris Baker and Im a PCSO on the FULHAM BROADWAY 24/7 SNT. I am also part of a group called LondonBikers. We are an informal group who get together every week and discuss the pros and cons etc… of owning and using motorbikes in London. Recently some people in the group have been talking about a peacefull protest / ride through the Londn to deliver a memorandum / petition to Mayor Ken Livingston. We understand that with something like this it needs to be done properly in order to maintain safety and order and would possibly involve road closures etc…

Now, my question is: what do we need to do, who do we need to speak to etc… Its only in the talking faze as yet and I said I would try and find out some more. I apologise if you are the wrong person to talk to and if you could then point me in the write direction."

"Chris

I am the right person to deal with your query.

we only close roads to traffic for marches to take place, so that the people marching are not endangered by

moving vehicles; we do not close roads to allow exclusive use of the roads by a particular group of motorists etc.

We assisted with a motorbike protest in October last year, going from Wembley to Central London, and it didn’t work.

Events of this nature are disproportionately disprutive to the rest of London.

My suggestion is that if you want to ride as a group to deliver a petition you can do so, but you will be bound by the

rules of the road and highway code etc, and would be sharing road space with normal day to day traffic.

You would also need to decide where the ride would finish, and look at the parking issues.

Sorry I cannot be more accommodating, but please let me know if your plans develop.

regards

Stuart Cornish

Insp CO11"

So…

42

Just what I suspected, very sadly. :frowning: There is a very strong anti-bike brigade in just the wrong places at the Met at the moment.

FWIW the reason the Ride for Rights went pear-shaped was because most of the accompanying Police Traffic guys weren’t normally on bikes, had no recent experience of group riding with non-advanced riders or even of filtering in London traffic, and wound up bunched up at the back. Useless. The Bikesafe guys had to all the hard work, and it was the Unity Support Riders who gave by far and away the most back-up.

What we really Do NOT WANT right now is the chance to give the ‘opposition’ an excuse to permanently forbid all large rides, protest or not. And the danger of that isn’t small.

Write to your MP and local Councillors and remind them that Bikers are Voters!

43

Thanks for that Chris, my idea was to do this on a Sunday morning to minimise disruption and also allow us to use most of the bus lanes which are usually only restricted mon-sat peak times - also making the point that we want to use the lanes. Rout wise I would suggest starting off near one of the bus lane routes that we are allowed to use 7 days a week such as the one running down the Commercial Road in the east End. We do not need for the Police to close off the roads to allow exclusive use by the bikes taking part.

44

crikey we are fighting a very big up hill battle here…but fight we have to…i have written to my MP I know him and I am a paying member so I will do my best…letter going now

45

hey only just noticed that extra ‘i’ giuilinao…you must be in admin with all those eyes…corny I know…

46

Not sure what the problem is…he didn’t say that it can’t take place or that we need special permission…just that it needs to be organised properly. We fully intend to abide by the highway code and do not intend for the protest to be a nuisance to other road users. Finding a parking place shouldn’t be too much of an issue - a suitable location can & will be arranged.

47

I’m not looking to stifle any ideas so by all means continue to debate this issue - it’s important.

However can people refrain from approaching groups or organisations on behalf of the site unless specifically asked to do so by the site owner (Jay) or those acting on his behalf.

48

hey good point macp…this is why we need full discussion, we need to make sure we are all moving in the right direction…and with everyones support, if we dont and strt infighting then we will destroy and credibility we may have…

I have written to my MP…

49

I thought his response was very sensible, the days of big demonstrations (walks, rides, drives, whatever) that disrupt life for everyday folk are over, thery are pointless and achieve nothing other than to pi*s everybody off. There are other methods which work - I guess even MAG recognise that by employing the ex Police Chief, can’t remember his full title. I am especially concerned by the Unity Supprt Riders, having seen how they operate. I’m probably making myself very unpopular by saying this (what, again ? :wink: ) when I say that they are a danger to themselves and the biking community - the way the operated on the Ace Cafe toys to Hospitals ride was terrible - if that was an example of what they do then it’s best they are not involved again as the some of them seemed to ride without regard for the law or basic common sense. The Bikesafe police were fantastic and I didn’t realise until parked up at the last hospital that they gave up their free time to do that . . . I’ll be doing what Guilliano (sp ?) suggested, that’s the way forward, not demonstrations, mass rideouts, protests and criticising the police, the Bikesafe chaps are brilliant and have been very good for the biking community in the background, as a new member of that community I’d like to see it stay that way.

50

Yes - the spelling is right! If it helps anyone pronounce it - the G is soft and in face to face conversation with me the O can be dropped!

As for the demo thing. I haven’t said that demos are bad - just that they need to be part of something bigger and they only work if they get media attention which the public generally atune to. I would be happy to meet up with some people to discuss how best to proceed, but we might be better off going to a MAG meet to do that, I wouldn’t know not having been to one for several decades.

51

Not their finest hour, I quite agree. :(Luckily the ones who hadn’t quite gripped the plot seem not to be turning up now, and the training will be much more rigorous this year. All should have gained or be close to IAM or ROSPA standards of riding, and in particular the group riding and marshalling techniques. It does take real-life practice though. The Fred Hill run went well enough, considering the traffic. :wink:

52

Funny you should say that, stay tuned. :wink:

53

As this seems to be building up a bit of rhythm it’s perhaps time to set out the ‘official’ position of Londonbikers.com in this matter.

This is an online forum and magazine that is seeking to appeal to a broad section of people not just motorcyclists. We are not a political lobby group so would not seek to promote action like this as a Londonbikers event as there is a danger of a negative impact to the name and image of Londonbikers.com.

However we would urge members who feel strongly and wish to get involved in working to promote this and other causes to look to MAG and the BMF. Getting behind the groups already working on our behalf can only enhance the work they do and add weight to the arguments already being put across on our behalf.

54

Erm, I know macp’s post has a certain finality about it so I’m a bit hesitant about this post but just a small point on the reply quoted by trashpuppy. The way I read it the man is saying there’s nothing to stop a large group of bikers riding through town if they want to. IMO if this were to happen it wouldn’t in itself constitute a political protest any more than a large group of cars driving through London would. Personally I prefer the Guiliano approach but each to their own.:hehe:

55

Now macp has pointed out that this thread is still here :blush: I can take issue with his comment ! :smiley:

What negative impact could there be to LB ? I would have thought a positive impact is more likely as bikers and probably some non-bikers will be campaigning for a positive, life saving change in the law, not for example the desire to ride lid-less. The change we are asking for saves the lives of pedestrians and cyclists as well as bikers - this was all pointed out in the report, fewer accidents and injuries, everybody’s a winner :smiley:

So what could LB have against that ? All the motorcycle press have been behind this report, ermmm, except LB, so . . . what makes LB so special it thinks it can ignore such an important report ? :w00t:

(We’re not talking about a mass ridout in London which will just alienate everybody, I understand that many companies would choose not to be involved with that)

56

Sorry you feel this way mate. As I said we think a protest rideout is apt to getting out of hand (over subscribed) and produce a negative impact it’s as simple as that.

This is not being ignored and never has been. Like everyone else we’re waiting for the report.

57

We’re not talking about a mass rideout as I said above . . . the report has already been leaked and right now it’s being doctored by the commies at TfL to show something entirely different . . .

58

I give up

59

Yslart, the BMF and MAG are the people to back with this, they do this all the time and are good at it. We’ll back them whole-heartedly, but for us to take this on oursrelves is pointless, we’re not a lobby group, we’re a community. We have limited resources and like any organisation, if the brand is to be used in a controversial manner, the brand needs to be absolutely sure it won’t put itself at risk, and there’s a clear risk we will alienate authorities, business’ and the general public. We have plans to promote biking more in London and make life better for ourselves. Part of this means working with business’ to do this. With this in mind, looking at the bigger picture, I don’t think it’s in the interest of this goal to be tackling issues like this at this point, we just don’t have the resources.

We can all do our bit though and back the BMF/MAG.

60

MAG want to give us the right to ride without a helmet, really not convinced they are the right group to take this forward - this is about reducing accidents and preventing loss of life, both bikers and pedestrians/cyclists and that’s not consistent with wanting to ride without a lid.

I wasn’t aware that campaigning for improved road safety for all road users was in any way controversial . . . and it’s not going to affect any future promotions other than to demonstrate that LB is a responsible community which is doing something comminities do . . . lobby for improved services and safety, you can’t get away froim the fact that this is exactly the kind of thign LB should be doing :wink: You can have plans for all sorts in the future but this is here now, it’s important and if LB isn’t taking a stand about this then what is worth taking a stand about eh ? :slight_smile: