Wow I’d forgotten about this thread (well, it was from last February!) will have another read of it cos there’s some good advice here.
many years ago i remember having to countersteer my lc350 to get it to go round corners,
i havent as yet had to counteer steer my srad round any track corners
but i think thats because if i go into a corner to fast i just lean over more in my head im thinking i wont make this then i remember someone saying if you dont think your make it try harder and you probally will its worked so far and now when i go into paddock druids or graham hill to fast i just lean more and seem to get round it ok , i will have a go at counter steering next year.
Q’’ if you countersteer round a corner does that mean you dont have to lean the bike over so much to get round it? as im allways scraping the pegs and boots but peolpe still seem to come past me more upright is that because they are countersteering???
Wouldn’t that mean they’re just hanging off the bike more, so it doesn’t lean as far?
I thought countersteering was necessary to be able to turn the bike above, say, 10mph. It’s my understanding that it won’t turn just by leaning alone…
I find myself countersteering all the time, for what it’s worth. I shift about in my seat and press down on the pegs whenever I go round a corner at speed.
Yes you could be right some of the people on trackdays do seem to be hanging off there bike where as when i tried to do that i thought 1 i looked stupid and 2 didint feel like i was in control of my bike i allways push down on the pegs whilst comming out of the corner but i do it to put more weight on the wheel to stop it spinnig , as the last 3 trackdays ive down i seem to be leaning over so far that there is very little grip on the rear tyre and have almost highsided 2 or 3 times which slows me down and makes me nervous about leaning so far over for quiet a few laps, The only time so far i came off on track round a corner was at silverstone , i had an instructor for the day he said i went in to the corner way to fast , i know i did but i thought i had made it ok into the corner and as i opended the throttle just after the apex to shoot myself out the corner the back let go on me and i slid across the track. i must of been lent right over as when i came off i didnt hit the ground with any force what so ever , that has put me off corners quiet a bit , but like i say it seems the faster i go the more i lean and the more likley it will lose grip on the rear wheel, i will be buying some instruction next year to see where im going wrong , 
as you can see i dont hang off the bike but there really is not much tyre left with contact on the tarmac
Well not that I know anything, but from what I’ve read in bike mags, they say hanging off lets you keep the bike more upright, so more of the tyre is in contact with the road - and therefore you get more grip.
From the pics, it looks like you’re leaning your body away from the inside of the corner while leaning the bike over to the max - which, presumably, is why you’re feeling the tyres losing it.
From what I’ve seen of racers, it looks like they have their heads right next to where the wing-mirror would be. So if they’re turning left, they’ll be almost kissing the left-hand mirror. But the bike seems more upright.
But, like I said, I’ve never actually done it myself… just going by what I’ve read. 
/Gets coat. 
Ha ha, i know what you mean Sherrie, but reading it like this, dun arf sound funny 
Its like, i want to go right at this corner, ok id better steer left, ooppss ok…err im NOW going left, but wanted to go right…ok so now i want to go back right, ermmm…better steer left…poor rookie buggers will be going round in circles all day, getting nowhere but more confused !!! :w00t::P:D…errr, bit like moi !!! 
+1 to above …and above. I find pushing on the footpegs will turn my bike, and yeh, you are pushing on the bars as well by instinct i think…dunno but i find i do that when needed, and yeh sometimes without thinking! Note to self…think more !
hanging off does too things - puts your weight off to the side of the bike (closer to the apex) so you can relatively stand the bike up for a given corner speed - this gives you more grip/higher potential top speed for the same corner.the second and possibly almost more important part given your post is that your knee is your lean guage. if you’re at full lean, you’re using basically all your grip for cornering. you have to trade your lean for accel or braking. doing both puts you on your ass (and yes, i’ve done this too even with hanging off!). bear in mind that a closed throttle still counts as brakinghanging off is a personal thing too - different people hang off to different degrees (check at the guy in the rear of my pic relative to me. grab a copy of twist of the wrist 2 - it should help with a lot of this stuff. in terms of the tread the stuff about counter steering is very good and helped me personally a lot with actively using it
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Love that pic !!!
Pushing on the pegs doesn’t put more weight in the tyres…
Thanks for the insight johnybravo and that is a great pic very pro looking, ill be looking out for a twist of the wrist herd a lot of good things about it,
and whistler , one of the instructors said in a classroom session that pushing on the pegs helps the tyre grip better thats what i ment by putting more weight on the tyre,. ???
track riding is such a learning experiance looks like ill be learning for years to come , one things true your never to old to learn , even if your a grandad:D wish i would of tried trackdays before my road accident as i had so much more confidence in my riding then than i do now, still next year is only round the corner , ill have another year of trackday riding to learn how to ride better and faster than i can now;)
cheers mate. dont worry by the way, we’ve all been the same place you are now (ask jonesy how much i obsessed about sorting my body position on track! )the pushing on the pegs thing is a bit of a can of worms but is actually related to the topic of active counter steering as it happensif you go with Keith Code (author of the twist books and started the cali superbike school) then pushing on the peg just makes the peg push back (equal and opposite forces). he teaches ‘pivot steering’ which basically is pushing from the opposite peg (outside) to help create leverage for active countersteering to push the inside barpeople argue that pushing on the inside peg helps with traction, but this may be coincidence as when they do this, they are also getting better body position as a by-product etc. theres a little vid on the superbike school site (or at least there used to be) where they show the demo bike which has fixed bars above the standard gear - they try to get people to steer the bike by just pressing on the pegs to help countersteer and they cant shift the bike.