URGENT​ - Witness appeal

Help & Advice Road Watch
1

A car rammed me (silver vespa) on Sumner road at the south east corner of Burgess park (Southwark). It happened on Tuesday 24th October at around 8:10 am. If you’ve seen it or parts of it, do let me know here on Twitter at @needwitness

Thanks for sharing :slight_smile: I regularly post updates on my quest @needwitness on Twitter so if you want feel free to follow and retweet.

The full story:

There was road works on Trafalgar avenue - Sumner road and it hold up the traffic badly. I filtered this extra long line of cars up to the first car and waited on his right hand side until I saw a group of 6 or so motorcyclists coming up. I feared they would block the road for incoming traffic so decided to move in front of the first car. Bad idea.

I proceeded cautiously because there was just enough room. Had my two feet down and starred at the corner of his car to make sure I didn’t touch it. I was then stopped in front of him, still starring at the corner of his car, when I saw him moving forward. I screamed to alert him but he collided into me. 

One of the motorcyclist was having a go at him when I came up to his window. I thought for a second asking him to be my witness but I thought I’d deal with the driver first (ALWAYS look for a witness first). I explained to the driver that he damaged my bike and then blocked his path forward to force him to stop on the side road (St George’s way). I didn’t trust him, and I was right.

Once stopped he proceeded to rub off the proof of the impact on his car. He lied about his car not being his. He stated that I ‘jumped’ in front of him and that I should be more careful. WTF. He then blackmailed me and lied some more.

I’ve been busy distributing notes to riders on my way to work. Putting signs at the local bus station which was packed that day but someone is dedicated to remove them overnight. I’m now standing by the side of the road and ask pedestrian while pointing at my signs I crafted and attached on trees (lucky me I’ve got a long, straight, major-junction free Trafalgar Avenue at my service).

I’m mainly targeting motorcyclists as the pack behind me would have seen everything. There were 5-6 of them. I’m determined to find a witness, not just because my bike is damaged, but because I’ve got the feeling he done it other riders, he needs to learn about responsibility. You can’t go intimidate and collide into riders without getting the consequences.

I thought the motorcyclist who chatted with him would have followed us, as I always do when I witness an accident. But as soon as the light turned green, everybody was gone (that was when I was walking back to my bike). I don’t blame them, we all need to be somewhere in the morning. I badly blame me for not asking. 

I have now bought myself a Drift Ghost-S camera as an early Christmas treat! That will serve as witness if I ever get in trouble again. I also use it to protect myself, the careless driver does come by my signs in the morning pissed off, lately he felt menacing. But that won’t stop me.

If you saw the accident or parts of it get in touch. All I need to prove is that I didn’t ‘jump’ in front of him. If you want to help, do share the word, this post or my Twitter account @needwitness. Feel free to follow and retweet.

Thanks in advance :wink:

Attachments

photo_upload.jpg
photo_upload.jpg750×1334 168 KB

photo_upload.jpg
photo_upload.jpg1334×750 276 KB

2

Hey you signed up, was me you stopped and spoke too.

Guys this lovely young lady, I have seen on the side of the road where the accident was almost everyday for the last week or two now.

If anyone knows what happened or knows someone who would goes that way please help her out…

3

Hey you :slight_smile: Thanks for letting me know about this forum. I’ve got an idea for the bus stop, I’m gonna write my message on the floor with chalk! Aha! Multicolour chalks. Gonna make a piece of art.

4

If you have his number plate you can just go through insurance and they’ll deal with it. They may decide to go 50/50. If you are involved in an accident always start taking photographs immediately. That can make the driver that has rammed you go irate but you have to just try and keep your cool. Even simple things like photographing the number plate help as you might forget to write it down. When a taxi rammed me the first time, he came out of the vehicle nice as pie and suggested I move my bike over to the pavement to get a “proper look at it.” I said, “no I need to take photos and I’ll need your details.” After that he became irate, argued that there was no damage, that I was holding up traffic, that he was going to lose his fare. Never mind that he just rammed me. He refused to give details and eventually drove off when I moved my bike after I’d taken my photos. No one around wanted to be a witness. London I guess. I paid £200 to get it fixed and wrote the cost off because I didn’t want my insurance to go up then reported him to TFL. If your bike isn’t badly damaged and you are not injured I’d be tempted to write it off move on. I’ve not come to expect much from people and your situation is another example.

5

I never asked and you didn’t offer the info, it was not a newish black Adui A4 by any chance was it?

6

It was a silver Vauxhall. That’s interesting that you’re asking about a black Audi A4 because a rider stopped by asking me just the same. He was rammed and knocked off his bike by it. He said the driver drove off, a pedestrian went on the road to stop the car driver but he swerved around him. The plate number was a fake.

7

The Highway Code may go against you, there can be a fine line between what’s accepted as filtering and what’s overtaking?

Looking at the situation from the other persons perspective, The Courts will, and taking into account The Highway Code Rules 159 to 169 at best you may be looking at a 50:50 or knock for knock (if that’s still a thing).

8

Good luck with finding someone, I’ve just retweeted your tweet for a witness.

9
It was a silver Vauxhall. That’s interesting that you’re asking about a black Audi A4 because a rider stopped by asking me just the same. He was rammed and knocked off his bike by it. He said the driver drove off, a pedestrian went on the road to stop the car driver but he swerved around him. The plate number was a fake. Karine
I obviously could not say for certain it was the same one the guy was talking to you about. But there is an Audi A4 who nearly took me and another biker out in one go.Literally does not care for any 2 wheeled vehicle on the road. When I approached him on it he just went hulk on me telling me I was talking shit.
10

@ National Treasure Thanks for the info. Don’t think we can call it overtaking as he was stopped. Seems to me it’s more to do with filtering. But yeah, all to say, I didn’t jump in front of him or crashed on his side. Had people doing it to me so I always make a point to watch myself when overtaking.

11

@Joby thanks for the advice :wink: After we stopped in the side road, I took plenty of pics, even got one with him rubbing off the proof of the impact on his car. :raised_hands:Took the whole car, plate number, brand logo in pic, all the damage on my bike. All good on that level. :ok_hand:

I asked for his name, just gave me his first name and when I asked for his insurance he told me it wasn’t his car (lie). My insurance called his and he states that I “jumped” in front of him so my insurance asked me to find a witness. Good thing is, he didn’t challenge the fact that there was collision.

A cyclist stopped by this morning, he said refusing to provide detail is a crime in itself and I should go to the police. I’m tempted.

12

He does not have to offer insurance details at the road side I believe he does have to offer a way of identify himself though. The reality is, if he has now accepted it was him diving through the insurance it is not worth the headache you would have to go through for nothing more than a slap on the wrist for not telling you his name.

13

The Highway Code may go against you, there can be a fine line between what's accepted as filtering and what's overtaking?
.
National Treasure
In law they are deemed as the same thing.  Even a rider overtaking at 60MPH has been deemed as still filtering.

Liability all comes down to the evidence and whether or not the rider breached the rules during that overtaking manouvre, so liability should not be an issue in this case.


He does not have to offer insurance details at the road side I believe he does have to offer a way of identify himself though. The reality is, if he has now accepted it was him diving through the insurance it is not worth the headache you would have to go through for nothing more than a slap on the wrist for not telling you his name.
The Sleeper
If it is a damage only crash, then you are correct that there is no requirement for either party to exchange insurance details.

However, there is a requirement for drivers/riders to exchange names and addresses (both of the drivers and owners if different) registration marks and if this is not complied with then it must be reported to the police as soon as practicable but in any case within 24 hours.  The offence that is committed is failing to stop and report an accident, and if it is obvious at the time that there was a crash, then the drivers must stop there and then.  The report it within 24 hours only applies where the drivers are unaware until a later date or they hit an animal that is rquired to be reported by law such as a dog, horse etc.

People may say that the OP is guilty of the offence, but it cold be argued that the driver drove off without offering details, and she felt threatened by his behaviour.  A court would not convict the OP but they would the third party.

In a civil case, I really do not see liability being an issue, and if the vehicle is insured and providing your insurers (and legal representatives ) are preapred to fight your corner (don’t hld your breath on that one) whilst witnesses can help, the case can still be proven in your favour if the job is done properly on your behalf.

14

@ T.C What does OP mean?

15

OP = Original Poster (Karine)

TC puts it so much better ‘In law they (filtering and overtaking) are deemed as the same thing’ Which is why I say 167 (DO NOT overtake where you might come into conflict with other road users. For example… where traffic is queuing at junctions or road works) may go against you.

16

If I didn’t filter where I might come into conflict with other road users, I’d never get home and might as well drive a car.

17

If I didn't filter where I might come into conflict with other road users, I'd never get home and might as well drive a car.
AlexT
filtering is a game of chance. 

ever week day I play the chance game 

If you choose to filter you should be aware of the consequences.

alot of the time what some people see as filtering the law says differently & you only find out when you have to go to court. 

 

18
filtering is a game of chance. ever week day I play the chance game If you choose to filter you should be aware of the consequences. alot of the time what some people see as filtering the law says differently & you only find out when you have to go to court.
This ^

I remember asking one of the motorcycle cops on a Bike Safe day what his views on filtering were. His response was: you are on your own, if you have a coming together the best you can hope for is the insurance settling 50/50.

Don’t forget filtering is banned in some countries. Of course we would be horrified with such a ban but most of Joe Public think we are (a) cheating and (b) acting dangerously by filtering. Given the lack of critical thinking ability in this country at the moment, I fear it wouldn’t take much for a ban to happen.

19
I remember asking one of the motorcycle cops on a Bike Safe day what his views on filtering were. His response was: you are on your own, if you have a coming together the best you can hope for is the insurance settling 50/50.

Michael748
Shows how inaccurate the Police are getting with their information these days.

The Police do not deal with civil claims.  The Police do not even get proper traffic law training anymore.

In 99% of cases, filtering cases go in favour of the filtering rider and there s very rarely any contributory negligence provided… The basis rules f overtaking/filtering are complied with.

50/50 split liability is an inaccurate statement to make.

20

I did ask for his name but not his address and we’re definitely post 24h so here goes the police claim. But good to know anyway.

When the collision happened I was already in front of him and stopped. Does it fall under filtering/overtaking?

What annoys me is that it was blatant intimidation too, he was pissed off I moved in front him. I remember him being way past the temporary “stop here” signs. I should have guessed his aggressive type just by his position.