+1
Isn’t it called natural selection? 
you make a good point, but there comes a time where a “fair do’s” for a certain risk being taken stops being a fair do’s, and becomes idiocy…
ur argument can progress as follows…
no need for leathers?..well no need for helmet?..heck no need for well inflated tyres?..no need to have lights on when riding at night?..it could just go on and on
everyone draws a line somewhere…myself…im not a big fan of high vis…others may think thats dumb, but i dont ride without leathers either…no beef with those do ride without…and no beef with those people who may not wanna wear helmets as well…
but their comes a time when risk taking becomes idiocy (if you actually care for your well being that is)…
and there’s a reason why bike racers wear full protective gear and back protectors, etc…i dont think its to give them a “false sense of security” as you put it…i mean we’ve all seen racers go tumbling down and rolling on the track - if they raced in shorts and t-shirts would that make them idiots or ballsy?
i guess its hard to know wether his mate is truly ignorant, or conning himself subconsciously, or whatever…but if his mate makes bold statements like leathers below 100mph are pointless - well that’s not opinion, its just plain wrong!
also just out of interest, i dont actually know the answer to this question, but:
Do a higher proportion of motorbike pro racers die or normal street motorbike riders like ourselves?..just wondering
I’m afraid that isn’t a progression of the argument. only the helmet is relevant as it relates to actually having an accident. the other two could increase the chances of you having an accident in the first place. even the tyres is moot point as relatively flat tyres would generally just make the handling slow, and only really cause an issue in the wet where the tread may close up. Again, i think you’ll find a lot of riders choose to go with other pressures than the handbook for various reasons which is their choice.
also i didn’t say the ‘purpose’ of protective gear is to give a false sense of security, nor that it doesn’t offer protection of some sort, hence racers wear it. a racers biggest issue is generally impact with the tarmac and high speed abrasion, not navigating traffic or hitting street furniture . Personally i find i ride differently if I’m leathered up compared to just in a t-shirt as i feel more vulnerable, not to mention the sensation of speed from the wind blast. I would not say the difference in risk awareness is proportional to the protection offered by the gear, but possibly that’s just me.
besides, do we really need to take steps to protect the ‘idiots’ from every single possible permutation of risk? no matter how much ‘gear’ you wear you’ll never deal with the issue of internal injuries from sudden deceleration, therefore the ultimate progression of the leather argument is that we shouldn’t ride bikes…
For me, it tends to be the lads that are a lot younger than me, but have been riding longer. Most people are cool, but one chap seemed to think he knew what I needed more than I did when I decided to upgrade from a Hornet to an R6.
I dont belive it matters what bike you ride as long as you feel comfortable on it and you ride it to your own level. We all need to push it little by little to improve, but under the right circumastances.
The other seems to think he is really grown up because he rode bikes on the road with no liccence when he was underage.
Both niave pratts if you ask me.
fair do’s with your points mate…i generally agree…
but wouldn’t you just kick yourself if you were fortunate enough to simply tumble on an empty road (at night say)…not hitting anything in your path, and end up with something like this…
or even worse road rash perhaps…the fact that us bikers will never realistically be able to protect ourselves from internal injuries as you say, or neck breakages, etc isn’t an excuse to neglect the less serious, but potentially painful effects of ripping your skin to shreds, and having to deal with the whole process of healing, etc in a hospital ward!..
admittedly, if people know the risk and choose to ignore it, its up to them, and there is no beef - each to their own!..but i defo think newbies should be warned about what can happen should you be riding in flip flops and shorts. As a newbie myself, I found it very useful to research peoples past experiences etc on forums such as this one. Just today in fact, I dropped my bike getting on it too quickly (dumb I know)…My boots took the whole weight of the bike - no scratches to the bike, and my leg was unscathed! And it was only for a 10minute ride down the road to get some petrol!..I am new to this game, and I really hope I never get lazy with putting gear on, etc!
i think almost every1 has rode a bike without some sort of protection at least once in their lives - no??i know i certainly did, and i paid the price, being so young(at the time - i was 17) and really thought i knew it all! and decided to open my 250 nsr (that i was riding completely un-legit) and i came off it whist wearing shorts, teeshirt and sandles, and my mates OPEN FACE HELMET!! although i was only going say 30MPH(roughly) i seriously hurt myself, i had a few stitches, a fair bit of road rash and still have the scars all on the right side of my body and had plastic surgery on my right eyebrow and the cheek bone area, still looking pretty though:P!! But all jokes aside - i have definately learnt from this mistake, it was totally my fault and im paying for it in more ways than one!now i wont ride in anything less than draggin’ jeans and a textile jacket along with a full face lid, decent gloves and a back protector!! or ill wear my newly aquired 2-piece leathers which are a bitch to get in too but i feel so safe wearing them!!LIFES TOO PRECIOUS!!
+1 
I just see the problem as Malthusian population control?:w00t:
I rode for 15 years without what you would call proper protection, leathers/textiles, just street clothes. I was lucky enough not to need them. I now will only ride in leathers or kevlar type jeans, why the change? Older and wiser maybe. Couldn’t really say, I think it came home to me when I was doing ridiculous speeds, looked down, saw the road flying past me and looked at my jeans and said, that aint gonna work if I come off.
I’ll always wear gloves too. I guess there may be times when I will go out ‘unequipped’ so to say but it’s not happened in the last year. When you’re young, you feel invincible, lessons are only learned the hard way.
yeep…
its stories like these that dont make me wanna find out the hard way…im sure my skin is no tougher than the next mans, so not gonna take any risks and find out!
I’m all for personal choice in life (as long as the choices do not impinge on other people).
I do wonder though when people are talking about the ‘right’ to wear what they like on their bike if they are really cognizant of the real effects of road rash and unprotected impact with the road.
I believe there are few who have experienced a sizable bit of road rash who would still ride in a t-shirt etc. Personally, I recall working with a guy, Mike, (who had years of biking experience) who showed me the horrific scars on his back and shoulders from road rash and who explained that they were just the beginning - it was the numerous skin grafts (from his butt and thighs) that made it even worse. He vividly described how the excruciating pain and months of not sleeping, endless bandages, trips to the hospital etc made damn sure he never went out without the right kit on again.
It’s not until you meet someone like Mike that you really understand the consequences of not wearing the right kit and how being a bit hot and uncomfortable now and again is a really small price to pay to keep your skin.