more4 waffenn ss program

Sorry to spoil the happy time , but watching this program at the moment . They are talking to ex SS , and all are smiling while remanissing … Why the fu~k are they still allive , let alone aloud on tv .

And they wonder why we stay outside of europe

Your resposibility mate, if you don`t take em out who will.

How you’ve managed to connect membership to a group responsible for some of the worst atrocities that happened 60 years ago with staying out of the EU in the 21st century is a complete mystery to me… :smiley:

Old age will hopefully , and sadlly :angry:

I have no answer to that . Apart from the whole county is run from certian istitutions, Eton and the like . Who normaly end up running the country. And you think they dont hold grudgess ???

Haven’t seen the prog, may check later if there’s a catch-up available for it.
But who are you talking about?

Allgemeine SS, Waffen-SS, RSHA, which division/unit, which commander, which soldiers?

Not everyone in either SS has committed atrocities.

Would you also have made such a fuss about a program where NKVD / other organizations ex-members had been interviewed?
Are you going to open a thread about everytime something comes in the TV about the PRC’s PLA too?

It was a generall programm about the SS so n0 division or comander name promenent

I was composing a long answer but being drunk i deleted it by mistake .

But have to say, my grandfather spent 3 years in an eastern pow camp for flying in suplies to russia , which was run by the SS and he was tortured !!! For having bandages ??.. He died this week 5 years ago . He still had the skars !!!

Sorry it cuts me up a little some times …

He was agood man and didnt deserve it …

Sorry to disillusion you but atrocities were committed on all sides. We haven’t learnt from the WW2, we just rave that we won, where great and good, and the Nazis were bad.

Hundreds if not thousands of German soldiers starved to death due to allied mistreatment after the war, the soviets persecuted them and tortured them.

Perhaps we should look upon that part of human history and say never again should be allow anything similar happen again. Mistakes and torture happened on all sides and to be honest it is shocking that is still happening and still acceptable by certain countries.

+1

My grandfather was also a POW after his plane was shot down. Though he never said anything about his time in the camp, I do know from my parents that he was a forgerer in the wooden horse escape. That’s all I know but I’m guessing that being an officer he had an easier time.

However he still gave money back to the hospital in germany that looked after him after his crash. However he could not bring himself to ‘liking’ germans. I think though this is a dying characteristic of that generation. Personally I hold no grudges about things that have happened in the past. The only thing is to make sure (at an individual and collective level) that we do not repeat these mistakes and start treating ALL human beings with the same respect…

A german man was drafted into the army during ww2 . He was not a good nazi he did not have pictures of hitler on the wall neither was he a member of the nazi party . This meant the russian front for him . Leaving his wife and young daughter behind off he went to fight . During the fighting it all went a bit pear and he ended up surrounded by the red army leaving him and many others trapped within stalingrad . Eventually the commanders surrendered . 90000 prisoners were marched off to the wilds of russia . At the end of the war 10000 of the 90000 were still alive and sent back to germany . The drafted man was one of the survivors and he returned to his home he had left many years before . He could not find his family eventually he found an old friend who gave him the news that his wife and daughter had been raped to death by russian soldiers but the authoritys put this down on the death forms as a blood poisoning as they did with all the women and girls who were killed this way . None of his family remained his home was destroyed and he had nothing . Eventually he remarried and had another family . 10 years ago his sister was located in switzerland where she had managed to escape to when the allied forces arrived to sack Berlin . This man was my grandfather .

Very interesting story, NumNum, many thanks for sharing it with us.

Impossible for us, who have not experienced it and hopefully never will, to imagine what it is like to experience the full horrors of war.

This will repeat because it is in our nature, unfortunately.

Yeah - as people say - every army across the world has a lot of skeletons in the wardrobe when it comes to war crimes - but we don’t hear about them because the perpetrators keep them quiet - whether it’s entering a small isolated village and machine gunning a load of civilians or just executing some poor shepherd or farm worker that is unfortunate enough to stray into their path.

I guess it’s just a question of degree (the scale of the crimes) and whether the crimes are part of an official or un-offical policy to commit genocide.

Any of you here who are male and young - or who have been young - just make an educated guess as to what can happen if you give a group of young men weapons and set them loose among a population - add into the mix anger, fear and hatred - and it pretty soon turns into a horror show.

Obviously not all soldiers behave like this - and on the flip side people have shown great humanity in extreme situations.

especially if they win, then the ‘victors’ of course are the heroes and have done nothing wrong, whereas the ‘losers’ are the worst, and done all bad things…
The victors write the history, which usually does not reflect reality (then and now).

@Numnum: So you’re German descendant then? Was your grand father with the 6th army, 4th panzer-army, or from another unit of Heeresgruppe B (army group B, post-split army group south)?

I cut it very short the full horror of what happened to my family during that time and once the wall went up and half got trapped in the east . It was a horror story that is so terrible it is impossible to tell with decency on a forum .

hm, can imagine the split / wall afterwards complicated things even more…

Me father’s family (incl. step dad, as his mother divorced/remarried, not war related) had a bit more luck.
Father (my grand father) was SS Eastern Front, iirc he was captured too but returned, step dad was regular Wehrmacht, Eastern Front, captured and returned 1955 to West Germany.

No family on the commy side, all were back in West Germany

Very german decent you can tell by the blue eyes and square head.
I do not know exactly what division he was in . I don’t know for sure even he knew . His description was . . . One day I was working in a brewery the next I was in a uniform with a gun going to russia . It all went as bad as is possible in the aftermath for someone who survived what he did .

Your family got lucky then . I had various members including my mother spend some cell time in the east . One my mothers cousin was shot and wounded trying to get over the wall . Then he was handed the stasi for questioning . . . this questioning took 4 years .

This is why Germany and France are so keen on the EU - to prevent any thing like WWII happening again in Europe.

I think these days Germany is one of the least aggressive, war mongering nations in the world - because Germans suffered so much during and after the war - and also they have been very honest in recognising the crimes carried out by the Nazi regime - which is more than can be said for many other countries who are still in denial regarding their previous and current generations role in mass murder and war crimes.

I was watching camera footage on the news of Syrian armoured vehicles crawling through the streets of towns that have attempted to resist the Assad regime - it reminded me of footage of the Nazis retaking the Warsaw ghetto.

This stuff never stopped - it is happening right now.

NumNum, it seems that the history of your family is a book that needs to written and read as a testament to politics, war, and the strength of human spirit.

I have a relative who wrote a book about his experience fighting for the Germans during World War I, being gassed by the British then the horrible post-war German experience resulting from the French forcing them to pay massive reparations, the resulting rise of the Nazis, leaving Germany for a new life in the UK, then during World War II sent to an internment camp in Canada (and his wife and daughter sent to one on the Isle of Man).

His daughter ended up marrying my Uncle. His book is called Tin Soldier, it’s very good.