Insurance courtesy bike - should I take it?

Off-topic
1

So last Friday I had a little bump when someone drove into me…

Been in conversation with the bike insurance solicitors etc and they have offered me a rental bike, the costs of which they will attempt to charge to the third party.

As it stands the blame is likely to go 100% with the driver, who’s car is insured luckily. This is according to my insurance company and has also been backed up by the extremely helpful T.C who I’ve been in contact with via PM - many thanks T.C!!! Really helpful bloke…

So the insurance say that they wouldn’t offer me the hire bike unless they were sure that they would win the case - but they still request that I sign a waiver whereby I agree to pay for the hire bike in the event that something goes wrong and the driver’s insurance company refuse to cover the costs.

Should I take the hire bike? My bike was my only form of trasport and I could really do with having one until my damaged bike gets sorted.

My only worry is that, although the driver of the car admitted liability at the time of the accident, and offered to settle up in cash for any damage repairs, he is likely to change his story now that insurance is involved. He actually called me last night and started telling me it wasn’t his fault, even though he admitted liability at the time of the accident and offered to pay for the repairs in cash. Once I told him the damage was in excess of 2.5k he said he couldn’t pay that in cash and we’d have to go via insurance which I was happy about.

So, my question is do you think I should go with the hire bike? I’m pretty sure the costs will be covered but I’ve heard the horror stories of people having to cough up for it in the end… Plus this claim could potentially go on for months if the driver is going to be a dick about it (which he is) and that would rack up a pretty huge cost on the rental bike if I have it for a long while…

Sorry this is a topic that has been raised before, I’ve done a forum search and read some old topics, but I’d like a fresh opinion from some of the more knowledgeable and weatherbeaten LBers if possible :wink:

Thanks, C

2

I wouldn’t unless 100% sure the claim goes against the bloke. If the bloke denies liability and then it’s one word vs another (though you say you have a witness) then it can be very hard to win (obviously we don’t know the details) but irrespective of whether you are in right…can you prove you are in the right?

If it goes 50%:50% - you end paying half the hire charges which could be a lot of money over a few weeks.

3

Who is the hire company?

4

Yes I suppose I should clarify what actually happened…

it was here, going north.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&ll=51.531277,-0.237172&spn=0.001932,0.004817&t=m&z=18&layer=c&cbll=51.531375,-0.237189&panoid=eYNGCavl2xASltgnMFQ4RA&cbp=12,347.95,0,3.51

I was filtering past two lanes of stationary traffic, at approx 15mph, when a car pulled sharply out of the traffic without signalling or warning, to perform a u-turn. I braked (progressively, my wheels didn’t lock up) but was unable to stop in time and I collided with the car at a 90 degree angle with the offside rear wheel arch. I was thrown forward and the front of my face either hit the side of the car or hit the tarmac - I can’t quite remember which but there is visible damage to the front of my helmet. The bike fell onto it’s RHS.

I picked the bike up and pushed it to the side of the road to where the car had stopped. I could feel something was not right with the front wheel straight away as I was pushing it - bent forks or brake disk, I suspected.

Two Romanian men got out of the car (UK reg) and the driver identified himself. A big group of people at the bus stop had seen/heard what had happened, one bloke even came over and started shouting at the driver of the car.

There was no right turn that the car could have been going for, a u-turn was clearly his objective due to the excessive traffic. He admitted to this at the roadside. He also admitted that he did not signal or look in his mirror before performing the manoeuvre… If only I had been recording him at the time!?!

There is also a TFL operated camera at the junction between Harrow Road and Scrubs Lane - I have applied to TFL to try an obtain the footage but they told me they will usually only release the footage on request from the Police.

I got the phone number of a witness who had seen what happened - I know I should have got more but I was in shock at the time. About 20 cars must have seen what happened but not one of them so much as rolled their window down to ask if I was okay - so thanks for that car drivers…

So it should on paper go 100% in my favour, but as the driver of the car has already started to change his story I’m now concerned that it could drag on for rather a long time.

Also, I can’t get my insurance claim moving until I make my final decision about the hire bike. This is because the legal company that handle claims on my insurer’s behalf will not deal with the case unless I take out a hire bike from them. If I decide not to go for the hire bike, then the case is passed on to another solicitor who then begins the insurance procedure from there…

Thanks for all input so far… Hope I’ve not been waffling on too much!

5

I’m not sure of the name of the hire company, I’ll find out tomorrow and confirm

I’m insured with Direct Choice, when I call their claims line I get immediately redirected to the bike hire / insurance legal company.

The name of the solicitors (who my case will be further passed on to if I don’t choose to take a hire bike) is Lions Davidson

6

Be careful with this one mate. With the benefit of hind sight and legal advice some people develop amnesia and change their story. Get it all noted down as soon as you can.

7

I had two crashes like that last year. Both times I took the bike from BLD. I was sure I would win both cases (and did) so the costs weren’t an issue but I think they had insurance to cover the cost of the bike if I was found at fault. The bike was 120 per day - crazy money - and both claims lasted weeks. In both cases the rental charge was more than the value of buying the rental bike brand new. Crazy.

To win the case you witness statement is vital. Also when the other side starts lying you need to show the lies are bullshit. My third party said I was overtaking at 70 mph but none of the damage to me the car or the bike was what you would expect from a 70 mph off. So that sort of evidence helps too.

8

Very true - happened to my missus - Guy admitted full liability at the scene, even told a copper it was his fault. Apparently it was his insurance company that told him he was not liable after the event. His story was changed from “I was turning left” to “I was going straight on” to put him in the best light.

We are still fighting it.

9

Do you need the loan bike? if yes i’d take it, I think the offer insurance in the case you need to pay for the hire (dont quote me) if you have another bike or dont need it I would leave it.

10

If you’re still unsure about taking the hire bike, why don’t you make a request for a reasonable amount of money to pay for alternative transport?

With one of the accidents that I had (foreign driver doing a u-turn, strangely enough…), I approached the third parties insurance company directly and asked for money to cover taxis etc. They paid up almost straight away because it was a lot cheaper than a hire bike.

11

i didnt have the option to hire a bike after my accident as it was my fault.

however, it has been suggested to me from other people that if i’d have a hire bike they would try to settle quicker, as it costs them money every day.

12

My experience was they don’t give a crap. The first accident cost them over 5k in rental bike costs (and the driver immediately admitted fault and stuck by that). In the second case the rental was almost £7k. The rental bike could have been bought for £6500 new and my own bike was only worth £4k.

What you have to remember with insurance companies is that it is a “cost plus” scam. If the costs of claims rise, they add on their margin and increase premiums. So when costs rise, they make more money. Cool huh.

13

No! Definitely not.

Especially since it sounds like they’re trying to force you to take it…never heard so much bullshit as your insurer saying they won’t start your claim until you take the hire bike. I’d steer well clear, it’s obviously a money making scheme and whilst it sounds like you’re totally innocent in the crash, it could be these Romanian guys do one back to Romania and leave you to pick up the bill.

14

Tricky one.

My brother Gordon had an accident in April this year that was caused buy an uninsured driver (not known at the time of incident) and it took months to get any cash to have £4000 of repairs done. The insurance company and MIB are still resolving it now.

The driver was overtaking another car (both coming towards my bro) at a signed hidden dip and caused my bro to have to brake and swerve to the left, the bike went down on its LHS and slide onto the verge narrowly avoiding going into the ditch. Would’ve killed him if he’d been any closer or my bro hadn’t reacted so quickly. At the time the guy took full responsibility and the driver of the other car offered to be an eye witness.

My bro was offered a hire bike and declined to take it because he couldn’t face another accident on another bike at the time, which is just as well cause the guy then started to change his story and said Gordon was going too fast - he wasn’t as he’d had to slow down due to mud on the road prior to this and was wary, and that he didn’t hit my bro so maybe he just lost control…which is stupid, why would my brother be doing an emergency stop on a country road if there wasn’t an idiot on his side of the road gunning it towards him?

And then it transpired the guy was uninsured, he wouldn’t answer calls from Gordon’s insurance company and when my bro asked the police to step in as he’d been hit by an uninsured driver the police said they weren’t getting involved as they weren’t called at the time of the incident (!?). According to our family lawyer the police should have gotten involved as my brother was hurt in the incident, but Gordon couldn’t stomach another discussion with unhelpful cops so after trying to report it twice, gave up. Luckily the eye witness has been very helpful and proactive but that’s the only good thing about the whole sorry mess.

Gordon’s possibly gonna sell the bike back to the garage as, even though they did all the repairs, it’s never been right since.
I’m just glad he’s alive and hasn’t gone round to the guys door with his mates, cause that’s what they all wanted to do! Especially for the 6 weeks he wouldn’t answer the phone!

Is the guy definitely insured?
Do you really need a bike to get around?
Will the eye witness definitely give a statement? This will be crucial as it’s his word against yours and he had a pal in the car.
Can you be arsed with more hassle should you have an incident on the hire bike?

15

Yeah so I’ve turned down the hire bike, as I want to actually get my insurance claim started instead of fannying around with this stupid claims management company.

When I call my insurers I get put straight through to a company called BLD who do claims management. I spent ages reporting my case to them on Monday, explaining what happened. Then they were trying to push a hire bike onto me, saying it’s 99% certain that they will get the costs back from the other party. But, they still request that I sign a waiver ensuring that I become liable to pay any costs incurred if something goes wrong with the claim… So it didn’t all add up properly to me.

Once I told BLD that I didn’t want a hire bike, they immediately started to fob me off as soon as possible, saying I should get in touch with the driver’s insurance company and sort it out with them. I told them I didn’t want to do that, I wanted my insurance company to get it sorted as that’s what I’ve paid them for. So the girl had to ask her manager and call me back…

I got a call back today saying I would have to report this with my insurance underwriter - Axa. So I tried getting in touch with Axa but went round in several extremely annoying circles whereby I had to keep repeating my information, only to be told I was being transferred to another department.

I eventually got through to the bike claims department and spoke to a guy who sounded like he was on the phone whilst waiting on death row… Told him all the same information about the accident that I had already reported to BLD AGAIN. The death row bloke then told me that the broker - Direct Choice - would now be dealing with the case and calling me on Monday.

I’m so sick of dealing with these awful, money grabbing scumbags that just want to push me along to the next person once I let them know I’m not a mug… I swear if it wasn’t for the kind help of T.C and weefrenchie (thanks) I wouldn’t know where I was or what was going on…

I’ve also been told that the Romanian driver hasn’t reported the incident to his insurers either so they have no record of the incident… This is a complete nightmare???

16

Yeah when you are dealing with BLD - they give the impression that they are a legal defense company (Bikers Legal Defense). In fact when you deal with them they make the most money from providing the bike to you - as I said I was provided with a bike cost £120 per day. £840 a week to rent a Bandit 1200!!. I felt comfortable I would win both times so I took it. In hindsight it was a risky decision. In your case if the Romanian driver doesn’t even report the crash it is starting out bad and is probably going to get worse.

I’m gonna PM you…

17

This whole thing sucks, I feel for you, I hate having any dealings with insurance companies - buying insurance or having to make a claim!
I can’t believe they want you to speak to the other guys insurance co.! What the hell did you give them money for in the first place if they aren’t going to help you with a claim?? Aye, get them told!

18

Never, ever take the “courtesy bike” offered by the claims man not with the claims mis-mangementagement company, it’s about the biggest scam you can get after “claims management”.

If you must have a bike while yours if off the road, notify you insurance company, hire privately and add the costs to your claim. They will likely get all sniffy but remember your contract is with the insurance company not the claims mismanagement company.

Odd bit. If you were overtaking two lines (even one line sometimes) of stationary or slow moving traffic, the general rule is that insurance companies, without any legal foundation, consider this filtering and 50/50 liability will be agreed by both sides, so factor in that you/your insurance company are likely to be stuck with 50% of the hire costs and you will lose NCB.

19

Never, ever take the “courtesy bike” offered by the claims mangementagement company, it’s about the biggest scam you can get after “claims management”.

If you must have a bike while yours if off the road, notify you insurance company, hire privately and add the costs to your claim. They will likely get all sniffy but remember your contract is with the insurance company not the claims mismanagement company.

Odd bit. If you were overtaking two lines (even one line sometimes) of stationary or slow moving traffic, the general rule is that insurance companies, without any legal foundation, consider this filtering and 50/50 liability will be agreed by both sides, so factor in that you/your insurance company are likely to be stuck with 50% of the hire costs and you will lose NCB.

20

Sorry Oldguy but that sounds like a load of rubbish to me… Where have you got that info from

I’ve been told now by several qualified people that the liability lies 100% with the driver as he is responsible for ensuring it is completely safe to go through with an unpredictable maneuver, such as a u-turn.

If there is a right turn in the vicinity then the other party can argue a 50/50 liability but as there were no side roads this is unlikely to happen.

The driver didn’t signal, admitted fault at the scene, was keen to pay my damages in cash, and knew it was his fault.