Insurance Advice... any experts on here today?

Motorcycling
1

Hi all…

4 months after starting a claim for the theft of my old Vespa T5 Classic and endless letters to and from the insurers, (Zenith, through Devitt brokers) I’ve just got off the phone very p*ssed off after them telling me they’re not going to pay because it wasn’t MOTd.

I told them this when it was stolen. It WAS taxed, so still parked on the road outside my house and I gave them a receipt for servicing and repair of the rear wheel hub and told them that I was going to get it MOTd, that was why I had reinsured it!

I’ve told them that I’m not accepting this, that I was never asked to provide proof of MOT at the time I took the policy out and that the policy doesn’t state that the vehicle must be MOTd.

They want me to send them a copy of the (Devitt) policy.

I’ve just had a read through it and in the general conditions it says:
“you shall maintain your motorcycle in efficient and roadworthy condition…”

Do you think this is grounds for voiding the policy for having no MOT, even though the vehicle wasn’t being ridden?

Anyone have any similar problems or a solution to these b’stards trying to fob me off with nothing?

2

not an insurance expert but do you have proof that the bike had failed an mot and that you were in the process of repairing it so that you could have it mot’d?

3

No, it hadn’t failed. It had expired and as I wasn’t using the bike I let it sit there. It was uninsured for about two months too.

Reinsured it at christmas and spent a week cleaning and polishing etc but it’s a fairly bullet proof scoot to be honest. I had it serviced etc so it was fine.

I’d booked for a new MOT on the Monday and it got nicked on Sunday night… reckon some thieving gypsy had seen me cleaning it all up and had it away.

4

so from what you are saying is that the bike was in running order it just had not been motd = i would think that if you provide them with proof that this has been done and just double check your policy to make sure that mot is not mentioned in there as proof of maintenance then they cant argue out of that.

if necessary, you may want to pick it up with a lawyer… in fact in superbikes, there is a lawyer that does a Q&A section there. It might be useful to contact him.

Another thing is to consider whether they would do this with a car thats stolen cos i am pretty sure that i have the same clause in both my car and bike policies. if their practice is not to do this with cars, then they are being discrimatory. (is that spelt right?)

5

In my experience and thats fifiteen years of pursuing claim against insurers for a living, they allways try to wiggle off the hook on things like this. But, they can’t, the fact is you weren’t entitled to use it on the road and you weren’t, keeping a vehicle with out an MOT on the road is debatable.

If you like I can look through the policy, but I think you have a good case. Not sure if Zenith are still a LLoyds syndicate, but if they are you can cause them all sorts of hassle with a complaint to the LMUA at Lloyds it self.

You can sue for breach of contract, how much do you think the scoot was worth realistically ? At worst they should be making some reduction in the amount paid out for the fact there was no current MOT on the bike. I also think the fact that the scoot was booked in for an MOT the next day works in your favour.

6

All you have to do is ask the garage that it was booked in with to show proof of the booking to the insurer! that should work?

7

I agree.

I’d ask the garage if they would kindly copy the page in their diary that has your bike booked in for it’s MOT and send it to teh insurers. I’d also mention to the insurers you’ll be sueing them for breach of contract adn be making a formal complaint if you are not satisfied with the outcome, if I were you, like dancbr600rider says. They are obviously now not playing fair so you need to up your game and play aggressive too. Just not having an MOT certificate is not proof that your scoot was not in a road worthy condition. It’s hard to prove a negative and that is essentially what they are trying to do.

Good luck!!

8

My mate was in a similar situation to you. He had a garage service his car and asked for the MOT to be done. He was involved in an accident and when he checked the doc’s the car had only been serviced, and not MOT’d

The car was written off. There was a lot of arguing between him and the insurance company. Initially they refused to pay becuase it had no MOT, but after a lot of back and forth, letters and telephone calls they took 10% off the settlement.

Might be worth keeping on their back and complaining.

9

Thanks for the advice.

I think I’m screwed but going to send them a letter threatening to seek help from the Fianancial Services Ombudsman and stressing that I was never required to prove that the bike was MOT’d. I told Devitts that it wasn’t when I bought the policy and that I had it booked in so I could start using it again.

Fecking hate insurance companies.

letter:

Dear Mr Pearce,

Please find attached copy insurance certificate and Third Party Fire and THEFT policy from Devitt Insurance in respect of the above vehicle as requested.

When I purchased this policy, Devitt were made aware that the vehicle was not MOTd as I stated that the reason that I was re-insuring the vehicle was to have it MOTd and begin using the vehicle for commuting again.

The policy was still sold to me at this time and my understanding of the terms of that policy is that I am insured against the theft of the vehicle.

Devitt requested copies of my Driving Licence, CBT Certificate and Road Tax Licence at the time that I purchased the policy but never requested a copy MOT as they were aware that there was no current certificate for the vehicle. Neither was a deadline set in which to have the vehicle MOTd. Please refer to Devitt for confirmation and copy correspondence if required.

You have been provided with the receipt for the full servicing of the vehicle which covered the engine, oil, air filter, brakes and lights on the vehicle. The receipt also included the replacement of the rear wheel hub. In effect the vehicle was made in to a satisfactory and well maintained condition at the time of that service.

For clarification however, I confirm that I was not using the vehicle on the road and had not been since June 2005.

I have also provided a copy of the current tax disc. The vehicle was kept in a designated motorcycle bay and covered with a waterproof motorcycle cover during the period that I was not using it and I regularly started and ran the engine on a weekly basis to keep the vehicle in good condition, and it was in very good condition. Very shiny. No scratches on the paintwork and no rust on the chrome. In June 2005 I had taken the vehicle to R Agius, a specialist Vespa retailer on Edgeware Road for a verbal opinion of value as I was considering selling it and was advised of asking in the region of £1,500. I do not have any written valuation to this effect.

Prior to the theft of the vehicle in the week between Christmas 2005 and New Year 2006 I spent several hours cleaning and polishing and checking every nut, bolt, lever and lamp prior to taking the vehicle for it’s MOT. Unfortunately, It never made it as far as the test centre because somebody else seems to have taken a shine to it and stolen it.

This issue has now been ongoing for nearly 5 months, during which time you have been made aware of all of the above, and you now inform me that your company doesn’t actually want to insure the vehicle against theft anymore? Am I to understand that my Insurance policy only actually covered my vehicle for Third Party and Fire?

I’m afraid that I find this situation wholly unacceptable and request that you reconsider.

I will be forwarding all correspondence relating to this matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service and making a formal complaint about the service that I have received from your company. I shall also be writing to the Customer Service Department at Devitt Insurance Services to complain about the lack of Insurance offered on this particular insurance policy.

Yours sincerely.

10

sorry to hear of your loss.i just had a thought while reading though the postings. if the insurance company are refusing to pay out because the vehicle was not in a roadworthy condition and well maintained, how can they going they make form such an opinion unless the vehicle has been found and inspected? Where is it now?

an mot describes the roadworthyness of the vehicle at the time of the inspection. so even if you had one they could claim it was not well maintained.

it seems to me that they should either find the vehicle and prove it was in bad order or pay up.

good luck with this one, they are all robbing bas###ds when it cames to paying out

11

sorry to hear about this. if you find out it’s breach of contract, gimme a shout. I work with a whole team of financial services and insurance lawyers! Hope you sort it out.

12

Will help if you’ve got any photos of the bike that show it as being in good condition, or even better a letter from the shop that did the recent maint work stating that in their opinion it was fit to pass the MOT & in overall good condition.

Otherwise even if they do agree to pay out for the theft they’re going to offer the going rate for an old scooter (when you say ‘classic’ I take it you mean old ?) that’s an MOT failure, which won’t be much, unless of course you’ve got an agreed value policy.

You also have to factor in that they’ll subtract whatever the policy excess is, so even if they do pay up, it may not be worth claiming. eg. if you have a £400 excess & they agree that the bike is worth £600, they’ll send you £200. Now whilst this may seen better than nothing, bear in mind for the next 3-5 years when you renew your insurance, companies will load your premiums as you’ve had a claim, so you’ll probably end up paying more than £200 extra over the years anyway, far more if you’ve also got car insurance & also if you move up to bigger bikes.

Good luck.

13

cut your loses they aint gonna pay up its just there way out, Halfords do some nice mountain bikes which is probably a better choice for a second option on two wheels…

14

Saw the same thing on another forum, he said that they have now agreed to pay out but still are holding some back because of no MOT but i beleave that he is still going at them for more.

15

Hello mate been reading your posts and i really feel for ya, Phone these http://www.ridersupport.com/ and they will help you, they are real hot on claims, let me know what happens? best of luck.

& click on

http://www.ridersupport.com/pngs/index.htm