Failed CBT, should they charge me for next session?

Hi guys, well this is my first post here so Hello to everyone.

So, I jus had my CBT course today. I read so many things about it and everywhere it say’s that it is impossible to fail and it is designed to teach beginners to be well enough to ride on the streets in one day. Well, I personaly think that it is really hard to do but if it says so, then I believed it will work for me. Unfortunately today after some basic training off road I was told that I can’t go on the road yet and need to get back another day for another session. Well, I wasn’t that bad, but of course I won’t argue, it’s all about the safety. The thing is that they charged me another 55 pounds for this upcoming session and I read on the internet that most training centres don’t charge their learners if they have to get back for some further practice. Is it fair that I have to pay? I am a bit confused now because I wasn’t even on the road and if I’ll go on my next session and I’ll fail there because of some stress then I’ll have to get back again and pay again and the costs will build up. I know that personal and others safety is more important than money but if it says “CBT will normally take you from complete novice to competent learner motorcyclist in one day” and it didn’t then is it my fault or instructors?

Well that depends on what they stipulated when you signed up for your original session… Did they say what would happen if you didn’t pass on the day?

Also, did they say why they were unable to pass you on the day? Did they tell you before they went out on the road session?

Well, there is nothing about extra fees on their website and when I was booking my CBT on the phone no one said about them too. Instructor said that when we started our introduction and I already paid for my course. There was 3 of us learners, one of us has been riding before, he passed without any problems and me and the other guy didn’t. Well, we went through almost all excercises, after lunch instructors has changed and we were with other one, we practiced riding and changing gears up to 3 and stopping and changing gears down, after doing it for some time instructor said that we are still not enough confident to go out today and we need to get back. Well, I was a bit disappointed, I could be less if I wouldn’t have to get rid of another 55 pounds which not guarantee that I’ll pass it on another session…

Well you should ask them why they didn’t let you know about the extra costs you might be liable to pay if they weren’t able to pass you on the day.

It is also a bit strange, firstly to change instructors halfway through the day and secondly to send you out on a geared bike as opposed to a twist & go scooter, seeing as you’ve got no riding experience.

What’s the training school you went to?

I already paid for next session, I wasn’t sure if all training centres doing it or not so I didn’t want to argue, I just want to pass it and start learning on my own pace. Well, I chosen the geared bike myself because I want to start learning on a proper bike straight away as my plan is to get a geared bike. I always wanted to ride a bike and I wan’t to realize this small dream so I just don’t want to waste my time on scooters because if I’d pass my CBT would be valid only for scooters and I’d have to do another CBT for manual later on.

I went to North West London Motorcycle Training

Geared bike can be trickier to get hang of and anyone would want them to err on side of caution - I’d be surprised if you didn’t pass after 2nd day unless you really are a liability to yourself and others. Go along and enjoy the day knowing you have got most of it already sorted. If they fail you again ask then for a detailed analysis as it would be very unusual.

Your CBT is still valid for geared bikes even if you do it on a scooter.

If you’ve already paid for your second day then I’m not really sure what you’re asking about…

" if I’d pass my CBT would be valid only for scooters"

Absolute nonsense! There is one CBT. The certificate is valid for any bike up to 125 whether auto, manual, scooter, monkey bike or whatever.
There is one exception and that relates to 16 year olds.

Well, I thought that passing a CBT is similar to passing your licence test - automatic is valid for automatic and manual for both. I am asking because I’d like to know if it is normal in training centres around the London, simple because if I fail again I’ll have to pay again and in this case maybe I should go to another shool or, if you say that it doesn’t matter if I’m doing CBT on automatic scooter or geared bike, pay again and pass it on the scooter.

Yes it’s normal to be called back for a second day if you don’t pass on the first day.

Yes your CBT is valid for a geared bike if you pass it on a scooter.

Yes you may have to pay for your second day. Were you not aware you might not pass within the day?

Did you feel like the training school was any good? If not, you can go to another place and re-take your CBT.

when I did mine, it was £100 for the first day and I was told before I even paid that first amount, that I would have to pay an extra £50 to come back a second day if I didn’t pass on the 1st day

Hope that helps

That helps a lot, thank you. I think shool is good, but as a guy who never been on a bike before I don’t really know what to look for in terms of quality of training. Well, I am a bit disappointed that there is absolutely no info on their website (at least I can’t find any) and no one told me about extra charges before I paid. It was worth to ask just because now I know that I can do it on scooter and later on practice on my bike all the weak points. Think that I’ll try one more time on geared bike and if I’ll have problems again then I choose scooter.

Thanks again for help

The CBT takes as long to complete as the student requires. They are generally packaged into a days training because that’s what most customers want. There is no pass or fail for CBT but each element must be completed to a required standard before the DL196 can be issued. The DSA publish two books telling you everything you need to know about CBT and taking you full test.

Surely it is perfectly acceptable for the school to charge you to return to complete your CBT??.. You are using their time and equipment.

It’s quite normal to have different Instructors for each element of CBT. The DL196 must be signed by the Instructor who conducted the road ride in Element E.

From what you’ve written, it sounds like you and the other student didn’t complete the exercises in Element C to the required standard, so the school provided you with extra tuition after lunch with another Instructor as you were not ready to go on the road; which again, is perfectly normal for CBT.

“Surely it is perfectly acceptable for the school to charge you to return to complete your CBT?”

Well wouldn’t that depend on whether they were failing students to earn more income, rather than failing them for a genuine reason?

I have never heard of anyone failing after doing the gearing and stopping, before going out on the road.

I HAVE heard of people dropping bikes and passing the CBT. I HAVE heard that you have to be literally dangerous to fail the CBT.

This school sounds like scam artists if they are failing people and telling them they have to come back another day, while doing the gear changes and stopping in a straight line? And two students on one day?

I would be reporting the school to the DVLA, Trading Standards and writing letters complaining of a lack of due care and reasonable skill in the provision of a service and asking for my money back.

I am a belligerent bastard though.

I done my DAS with this school and I think that they know what to do and they had a reasons. I done my CBT with another school and all 4 off us passed but for sure 2 guys should’t be on road. Better safe than sorry.

I know the school in question and they are a good school… I don’t work there BTW…

The problem with CBT is most people arrive for their training with very little expectation or understanding of the requirements of the course and having never ridden a bike before, struggle to complete in one day. There is a lot to get through on a CBT course, and I personaly, would like to see it done over two days… but who’d want to pay for two days when you can do it in a day, right??..

Two students not completing in one day isn’t that rare either… Some days all students get through and some days none… it all depends on the persons ability to learn, co-ordination, balance, etc etc…

Apparent bias reeks in this system of CBT schools.

It is ripe for ripping off naive customers, who as you so rightly point out, know very little about what to expect.

It is all too easy to fail an individual, who knows no better, and reap the rewards for doing so.

That’s some statement Kaos…

Yes, there is potential to gain repeat business by not completing CBT in a day, but any school doing that would soon get a reputation for it and that would hurt the business in the long run with word of mouth and online reviews ect. It’s no different to going to the Dentist for a check-up and having to return because the work couldn’t be done in your half hour appointment; you need to book and pay for another session.

There will always be the odd school that has a habit of ripping off their customers, but it’s not the norm. Most Instructors are very good at what they do and want people do get through CBT and onto motorbikes. However, some students do not have the ability to ride naturally and it therefore takes time and practice to grasp the basic skills, often involving more than one session.

Where is the benefit to this school allowing “Manfronsound” to return for a second session at £55.00 rather than full price?? Surely the school is now down on profit because that returning student has taken the space of a full paying student… Well done to the school, I say. They could have “ripped him off” and flogged it to him at full price, couldn’t they??..

Its perfectly normal and reasonable to be charged for the extra tuition. If the instructor has any doubts over your safety on the road the road test shouldn’t go ahead. A reputable training school will show all their fees up front.

For CBT training I recommend RAKtrain out in Harlow Essex, they have a private track/road complete with roundabout, cross roads, T junction, road signs etc.

Art junior did his CBT with them last year and he had an off, nothing serious just limped around with a bruised and swollen knee for a week. Anyway, as a result he was a little nervous on the bike and they gave him an extra 10 hours training over the course of 4 afternoons so he could regain his confidence, half of the extra training was one on one!

And the cost was reasonable, one day CBT £99.00 (6 hours training, no road ride), 10 hours extra private road/track training free, half day training and CBT road ride £40.00.

Inter webbby linky wotsit here

Surely this is one of the most likely times to be told ‘Sorry, you can’t carry on’.

One when I did my CBT had this happen. It’s a HUGE step going from a parking lot/tennis court with cones, to going out on the road. If I saw some kid that didn’t really have control over his bike, I wouldn’t particularly want to have the responsibility of taking him out on the road where he could kill himself!