Cardiff riots: Police refer themselves to watchdog after crash deaths

Lots to unpick there TC - but I’ll go easy on you…

Why do you label the 2 lads as scrotes? I ride two up (One in a bucket seat) on a push bike on the public roads every Friday as it goes, is it a crime?

What’s an illegal bike?

Seems to be some confusion here - TC said they were on a scooter (which would be illegal) but riding ebikes is not illegal as far as I know.

My understanding is that e-bikes that only provide assistance (i.e you still need to pedal) and will only provide assistance up to 15.5mph are perfectly legal. If it provides assistance above 15.5mph or doesn’t require you to pedal, it’s classed as a powered two wheeler and needs to be type approved and registered with DVLA for use on the public road. Seeing as the rider wasn’t pedaling and was seemingly going faster than 15.5mph it was an unregistered motorbike without type approval. Being unregistered also means it won’t be taxed/insured etc

So was it illegal to put such ebike on the road?

It was as legal as a motorbike that wasn’t approved for use on public roads (i.e race/dirt bike) and that wasn’t registered with DVLA/no number plates . The fact it LOOKED like a push bike makes no difference, it’s classed based on its capabilities rather than its form factor Electric bikes: licensing, tax and insurance - GOV.UK

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The real issue here is the carefully worded statements given by 3 senior police officers, all of whom appear to be playing down the police involvement and in denial that a police pursuit took place.

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Well said. The people may well have rioted as they blamed the police for the crash, but lots of people who have since expressed concern have done so due to what is seen as the police trying to cover something up and that in turn results in a breakdown of trust between the public and the police.

A development, the two police in the van following/chasing* the lads who died - they have now been served with notices by the IOPC - means that they are now being individually investigated for gross misconduct. (Doesn’t assume guilt)

*Take yer pick - guess that’ll be a large part of the IOPC investigation.

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Another teenager in Salford has since crashed his e-bike and died after being followed by police, as well as a teenager in Dublin who died after apparently losing control of his e-bike and crashing into a pillar. Push bike frames with no suspension and with skinny little delicate tyres just aren’t built for the kind of speed that some of these e-bikes can do now.

I have a feeling this is going to be a growing trend and whilst it’s absolutely right that any police action that results in a death is properly investigated, I think they need to be very careful not to scapegoat the individual officers out of hand as this risks making individual officers scared to enforce the laws surrounding these e-bikes. This risks making an e-bike a get-out-of-jail-free card, just like the explosion in scooter enabled crime with the riders immediately throwing their helmets away as soon as the police appeared as they knew the police would instantly abort.

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Nobodies looking for a scapegoat. We’re just questioning the playing down of events, the carefully worded police statements and the denial that a police pursuit took place. Wake up and watch the video, there can only be one conclusion and that is the police van was in pursuit.

This is not a case of “throwing their helmets away”, these lads never had helmets to throw away. This is a case of police denial, police cover up and of police continuing to pursue helmetless lads after they failed to stop.

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